Wrestling Live Thread: Penn State vs. Nebraska

[BruceK-PSU83]

Sorry, he rolled through and didn’t warrant 2 stall calls there. One I’ll give you. But not 2.
Then the standing on the edge. lol. Wow.

Like I said, one can perhaps debate a couple of the stalling calls. But focusing on the stalling calls misses the more fundamental issues of giving up an escape off a restart with like 13 seconds left in the first period, and failure to get out from bottom in the second period. Without those missteps, Beard is likely ahead by a couple points going into the 3rd period, vice being tied, and he's not giving up three stall points in the match.

Of course, the root cause of all this is likely related to Beard's lack of a good gas tank.

 

[nitlion6]

The problem was hitting him with the stall call with no verbal count. He definitely counted to five with the one leg before calling the stall. I think Beard got flustered after the stall call and walked him off the mat. If the ref is calling a stall based on a 5 count on the leg, he should count it out for the wrestlers to hear.

It wasn't a five count. It was because he was doing nothing with it. He was just standing there. At least pretend you are trying to put him back on the mat.

 

[slushhead]

Which is fine in a vacuum, but when it’s not called that way the rest of the dual you wonder why it’s suddenly being called left and right. And to clarify, I don’t think it’s bias, I just think it’s bad.

I guess I just don’t see the point in getting worked up over it. A lot of these live match threads turn into b-fests about the officials. I normally just ignore or choose not to participate, and probably should have stuck to that practice today.

Bottom line for me is Beard showed the superior skills, and if he had the gas, the official would have had no involvement. If we are comparing to other matches . . . maybe Serrano’s activity level may have been the closest comprison to Beard’s . . . but Serrano wasn’t anywhere near sniffing a lead to cling to. Situation can and does play into the official’s judgment calls — always has and probably always will.

I agree stalling should be called consistently regardless of circumstance, but it seldom ever has in the 30 yrs I’ve been involved in the sport, and I stopped expecting that to change a long time ago. It’s easier to enjoy the wrestling once you can look past what the official is or isn’t doing (my experience, at least).

 

[apoharrow]

Isnt the third stall call two points?

 

[mcpat]

I guess I just don’t see the point in getting worked up over it. A lot of these live match threads turn into b-fests about the officials. I normally just ignore or choose not to participate, and probably should have stuck to that practice today.

Bottom line for me is Beard showed the superior skills, and if he had the gas, the official would have had no involvement. If we are comparing to other matches . . . maybe Serrano’s activity level may have been the closest comprison to Beard’s . . . but Serrano wasn’t anywhere near sniffing a lead to cling to. Situation can and does play into the official’s judgment calls — always has and probably always will.

I agree stalling should be called consistently regardless of circumstance, but it seldom ever has in the 30 yrs I’ve been involved in the sport, and I stopped expecting that to change a long time ago. It’s easier to enjoy the wrestling once you can look past what the official is or isn’t doing (my experience, at least).

But then who are we going to blame for close losses?

 

[Lovethissport]

Isnt the third stall call two points?

Warning, Point, Point, Two (I think).

 

[pish69]

I guess I just don’t see the point in getting worked up over it. A lot of these live match threads turn into b-fests about the officials. I normally just ignore or choose not to participate, and probably should have stuck to that practice today.

Bottom line for me is Beard showed the superior skills, and if he had the gas, the official would have had no involvement. If we are comparing to other matches . . . maybe Serrano’s activity level may have been the closest comprison to Beard’s . . . but Serrano wasn’t anywhere near sniffing a lead to cling to. Situation can and does play into the official’s judgment calls — always has and probably always will.

I agree stalling should be called consistently regardless of circumstance, but it seldom ever has in the 30 yrs I’ve been involved in the sport, and I stopped expecting that to change a long time ago. It’s easier to enjoy the wrestling once you can look past what the official is or isn’t doing (my experience, at least).

Generally I try to stay away from “ref sucks” or “stalling” grievances. That being said..can anyone remember a match where one guy gets 2 takedowns to none and lost?

 

[slushhead]

But then who are we going to blame for close losses?

If you want a funny example . . . I used to poke fun at the Mike Evans Act relentlessly back in the day. When Matt Brown lost a close match to him one time, a poster actually blamed me for it. Implied I had somehow motivated Evans to wrestle hard enough to win. Not kidding.

 

[mcpat]

If you want a funny example . . . I used to poke fun at the Mike Evans Act relentlessly back in the day. When Matt Brown lost a close match to him one time, a poster actually blamed me for it. Implied I had somehow motivated Evans to wrestle hard enough to win. Not kidding.

Sounds like he wanted to impress you.

 

[KCLion]

Generally I try to stay away from “ref sucks” or “stalling” grievances. That being said..can anyone remember a match where one guy gets 2 takedowns to none and lost?

Schultz had 0 offensive points.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

Big 10 champs - we get the Schembechler Award!!!!

 

[mcpat]

Big 10 champs - we get the Schembechler Award!!!!

Awesome to go undefeated in Big Ten duals but it’s going to be tough to win at Iowa again next year.

 

[mcpat]

Schultz had 0 offensive points.

Unfortunately, they track total points.

 

[KCLion]

RANK	NAME	SCHOOL	YEAR	NATIONAL RANK
1	Ryan Deakin	Northwestern	SR	2
2	Brayton Lee	Minnesota	SO	7
3	Peyton Robb	Nebraska	SO	8
4	Kendall Coleman	Purdue	JR	11
5	Kaleb Young	Iowa	SR	12
6	Will Lewan	Michigan	JR	15
7	Garrett Model	Wisconsin	JR	22
8	Chase Saldate	Michigan State	SO	HM
9	Bryce Hepner	Ohio State	FR	NR
10	Robert Kanniard	Rutgers	SO	NR
11	Derek Gilcher	Indiana	FR	NR
12	Joe Roberts	Illinois	FR	NR
13	Terrell Barraclough	Penn State	SO	NR
14	Lucas Cordio	Maryland	SO	NR

Where would Brady Berge pencil in at this weight?

 

[RB-Old]

If you are someone who wants a 3 point TD rule change, that match is evidence exhibit A. That was an embarrassing display of wrestling officiating.

I don't think you should change rules because refs stink, you just get rid of the bad refs.

 

[Lion8286]

Big 10 champs - we get the Schembechler Award!!!!

 

[NittanyLion84]

In Iowa they get tons of calls by pressuring the ref constantly with inane calls for stalling. Why does it seem we get hosed at home?

That’s because we have a knowledgeable fan base. We don’t have an entire crowd of deranged lunatics, constantly calling for a fake stall call. Personally, I much prefer our fan base and atmosphere.

 

[Str8DBLz]

Kinda worried how kerk grabbed his Hammy in that match

 

[ss7]

Thank you.

I love Beard, but he was clearly gassed most of the match.
- Head down on the mat and doing nothing most of the 2nd period = 2 stall calls.
- Holding leg in standing position without an effort to return opponent to mat = 3rd stall call.
- Pushing guy OOB to get a restart = 4th stall call.

I imagine #3 had some influence on the judgment made in #4, but it is still a valid call.

I don't disagree, but it's an illustration of why I really dislike what they've done with stalling in recent years.

Schultz did not "earn" those calls by wrestling more aggressively or anything. Beard was caught in one of the handful of situations where we've (arbitrarily) decided something is stalling.

Stall calls are no longer typically driven by aggressive wrestling. More and more, they're driven by these little games guys can now play within the match to grind out an extra point here and there without actually wrestling.

 

[slushhead]

Kinda worried how kerk grabbed his Hammy in that match

It is not season-ending . . . at this point in time.

 

[Str8DBLz]

It is not season-ending . . . at this point in time.

I hope not anyways..

 

[slushhead]

I don't disagree, but it's an illustration of why I really dislike what they've done with stalling in recent years.

Schultz did not "earn" those calls by wrestling more aggressively or anything. Beard was caught in one of the handful of situations where we've (arbitrarily) decided something is stalling.

Stall calls are no longer typically driven by aggressive wrestling. More and more, they're driven by these little games guys can now play within the match to grind out an extra point here and there without actually wrestling.

I get your point, and guys will always game the system. But I am still thankful for the 5-count rule. Remember how Evans would
just tight-waist-grab-ankle from top on the whistle and run the guy clear across the mat and OOB over and over? So glad to not be seeing that anymore.

 

[PSU Mike]

Big 10 champs - we get the Schembechler Award!!!!

Decline it 😒

 

[SWPA]

Ok, how many Brady Berges are you guys seeing? I see two, maybe three.

 

[WildTurk]

Kinda worried how kerk grabbed his Hammy in that match

He was in a little discomfort but nothing to terrible looking.

I had hamstring issues when I played rugby. They can be tricky as they tend to linger around. Rest followed by heat stretching & massage. Don't rush it back like I did!

 

[johnstownsteel]

Not here to argue. That's my opinion.

One I have to agree with.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

He was in a little discomfort but nothing to terrible looking.

I had hamstring issues when I played rugby. They can be tricky as they tend to linger around. Rest followed by heat stretching & massage. Don't rush it back like I did!

And it’s nice now to have MRIs so healing is easier to figure out - you’re not just going by feel. I was plagued by groin and quad strains playing soccer and always rushed back

 

[Kale_yeah]

Extra matches:
Brandon Meredith wins 7-6, Donovan Ball wins 8-2

Thomas hits rock bottom with that loss, 4 timer in hs in iowa.

 

[tpnlion]

I like Michael and think he’s very talented. Unfortunately he deserved to lose that one. Gave up that escape with a little time left in the first period, and then got ridden the whole second period. He needs to clean those things up if he’s going to ever be an All American.

He already is an all american….

 

[jmadden1998]

Just verifying that Beard is an All-American.

 

[johnstownsteel]

Ok, how many Brady Berges are you guys seeing? I see two, maybe three.

Rough weekend for Beau but love seeing that big smile on his face. I see that as a very good thing. Have to have a short memory, put those losses behind him and grind on!

 

[CholleyVandine]

i tried to explain this when the rumors of his transfer first started haha. it was funny seeing some on here thinking he was going to come in and get some psu magic dust sprinkled on him and light up the scoreboard. he’s always been a win ugly guy and he does a lot of it.

To Clay’s point, Hildebrandt had two low scoring matches this weekend in which he had complete control for seven minutes. That’s not the same as winning ugly.

 

[seeyajohn]

I just reviewed this whole thread and it is clear that this referee and all referees simply do not call stalling nearly enough against our opponents and call it way too much against our guys!

 

[donboy6499]

Which is fine in a vacuum, but when it’s not called that way the rest of the dual you wonder why it’s suddenly being called left and right. And to clarify, I don’t think it’s bias, I just think it’s bad.

That’s the thing it’s not bs, it’s just inconsistent.
I’ve seen lots of stall calls on the bottom guy, seen two in one rideout. That’s not the issue. The issue is that, if the impetus is on action, that’s cool, Schultz spent the 1st period backpedaling and the 3rd not attempting one attack. 4-0 there is really bad.
The guy did try a roll through which, I’m sorry, was more action than Schultz showed on his feet the entire match.

 

[KCLion]

To Clay’s point, Hildebrandt had two low scoring matches this weekend in which he had complete control for seven minutes. That’s not the same as winning ugly.

I hope he “wins ugly” all the way to the semis. I’d settle for quarters with a couple more on the back side.

 

[johnstownsteel]

Rec Hall obviously doesn’t have the same affect on a refs psyche like Carver does.

 

[bwfight]

Its very hard to criticize out coaching staff after so much success. But to look for one thing…I think they two often take the traditional “I choose down” option. If Beard goes neutral in second period he wins that match. Have seen that a few times this year with other matches. All the way back to Molinaro v Dake (although that was apparently Frank’s call). I see it all the time in high school. A kid is competitive on his feet and then chooses down and gets destroyed. I get having faith in the guy’s ability to get out but it seems a throwback to when there was no option to take neutral. Even in a match like Brooks when he is putting on takedown clinic…why go underneath and kill some clock? I just dont get it.

I think Cael wants to see if they can get out when nothing meaningful is at stake. Part of his assessment process.

 

[mcpat]

I think Cael wants to see if they can get out when nothing meaningful is at stake. Part of his assessment process.

You hear PSU wrestlers through their careers talk about how they are better in all positions. You don’t get better in all positions avoiding them in meaningless duals.

 

[Creek Side]

Did anyone notice Max Dean on the bench today? I looked for him on the broadcast and didn't see him.

 

[Shifty15]

have to have a name beginning with "j" to post here?

I mean, there is:
jammenz
js8793
jrod65
jmadden1998
jhonyt9

I think this is why johnstownsteel always has me confused.

If you want a funny example . . . I used to poke fun at the Mike Evans Act relentlessly back in the day. When Matt Brown lost a close match to him one time, a poster actually blamed me for it. Implied I had somehow motivated Evans to wrestle hard enough to win. Not kidding.

Well, you knew someone would ask…was Mike impressed with that?