MN vs IA

[PSUer1989]

You truly are obtuse. So because PSU fans don't yell for stalling every second of the match, they have no passion? You made a stupid comment about PA culture and now are trying to support it with sound levels in the BJC. Earlier you commented on the environment in PA States... Keep throwing stuff at that wall, maybe something will stick.

 

[russelscout]

You truly are obtuse. So because PSU fans don't tell for stalling every second of the match, they have no passion? You made a stupid comment about PA culture and now are trying to support it with sound levels in the BJC. Earlier you commented on the environment in PA States... Keep throwing stuff at that wall, maybe something will stick.

Nothing more exciting than 15k people completely silent!

 

[PSUer1989]

Nothing more exciting than 15k people completely silent!

You know you can undo the mute button? Technology can be tough...

 

[bigs22]

I heard the States at the PA high school tourney are pretty dead. Just because there is a bunch of talent doesnt mean its part of the culture.

So you are going to tell us what you “heard” our state tournament is like and use that as a pillar of your argument.

Idk why you are so annoyed by my statement. The state tourney is different than it is in Iowa. Its just a fact. Yeah PA has better wrestlers. It doesnt mean that wrestling is more culturally significant there than it is in Iowa.

And now it’s just a fact that our tournament is different, again based on what you heard (though you don’t mention that this time) unless I’ve missed something.

You’re really itching for an argument aren’t you?

 

[McScoreley]

Yeah, that was kind of embarrassing. I knew the moment Brooks was on the leg. I dont understand how he didnt.

Sammy gets a ton of props on this board for how much balls he had/has. He didn't want to wrestle in reverse like a lot of people do against Bo to keep it close. He would rather get pinned knowing he was attacking. His mullet interview and how all reports are he's a great young man has earned him a ton of fans on this board as well.

 

[russelscout]

So you are going to tell us what you “heard” our state tournament is like and use that as a pillar of your argument.



And now it’s just a fact that our tournament is different, again based on what you heard (though you don’t mention that this time) unless I’ve missed something.

You’re really itching for an argument aren’t you?

Yeah, I was wrong there. My bad.

 

[russelscout]

You know you can undo the mute button? Technology can be tough...

My favorite part was when Verk goes into OT against the number 1 guy and you can hear a pin drop. The passion and excitement was something else.

 

[82bordeaux]

My favorite part was when Verk goes into OT against the number 1 guy and you can hear a pin drop. The passion and excitement was something else.

We try to keep his adrenaline levels in check. See, we are a very cerebral group of fans.

 

[russelscout]

We try to keep his adrenaline levels in check. See, we are a very cerebral group of fans.

Thats probably a good idea. A bit more introspective than the HR crew, thats for sure!

 

[82bordeaux]

I know that @russelscout points out some things that we as avid PSU wrestling fans don't like hearing. But to bee 100% honest, he is speaking the truth about BJC matches. The energy is totally different than Rec Hall matches. Which leads to a question that has been discussed before. The limited tickets at Rec Hall limits exposure to a broader fan base. I have 2 kids at Penn State and brought 12 kids to that match last night. But they were largely silent because they don't know enough about the sport. They loved it and would love to go to more matches, but they have no access. So we can have success as a program, but we will not rock the BJC until we get the students more involved. After all, it is the student body that makes Beaver Stadium a tough out for any team. Just think what the BJC would be like with 4000 rabid students wrapped around the 200 level.

 

[russelscout]

I know that @russelscout points out some things that we as avid PSU wrestling fans don't like hearing. But to bee 100% honest, he is speaking the truth about BJC matches. The energy is totally different than Rec Hall matches. Which leads to a question that has been discussed before. The limited tickets at Rec Hall limits exposure to a broader fan base. I have 2 kids at Penn State and brought 12 kids to that match last night. But they were largely silent because they don't know enough about the sport. They loved it and would love to go to more matches, but they have no access. So we can have success as a program, but we will not rock the BJC until we get the students more involved. After all, it is the student body that makes Beaver Stadium a tough out for any team. Just think what the BJC would be like with 4000 rabid students wrapped around the 200 level.

This is exactly it, but it would take a bit. The reason Carver is loud is because it has been for a long long time. No new person is going to feel uncomfortable about taking part in the rowdiness when everyone else is exactly the same. BJC just doesnt get used enough to develop that kind of consistent atmosphere. Why hasnt it been moved to BJC full time yet?

 

[82bordeaux]

This is exactly it, but it would take a bit. The reason Carver is loud is because it has been for a long long time. No new person is going to feel uncomfortable about taking part in the rowdiness when everyone else is exactly the same. BJC just doesnt get used enough to develop that kind of consistent atmosphere. Why hasnt it been moved to BJC full time yet?

Haven't you heard? We're a basketball school now.
As I said, we like our Rec Hall atmosphere. And I think there are often scheduling and logistical issues. But there are many more informed posters that could shed more light on that.

 

[nitlion6]

I thought it was pretty loud when Nick was snorting kicking Luke and it was definitely loud when Mark was decking his kid. Everytime Aaron was taking Rocky down it was loud.
Carver had a quiet crowd at times during the PSU match and if Hall had beaten Kemerer the noise level during 197 and Hwt would have been minimal.
A couple seasons while PSU was stomping the birdshit out of the Hawks the BJC noise was consistent and loud.

 

[russelscout]

if Hall had beaten Kemerer the noise level during 197 and Hwt would have been minimal.

ya, good thing that didnt happen though

 

[82bordeaux]

ya, good thing that didnt happen though

I know. It would have tempered the pain from when we shock you in Minneapolis.

 

[pawrestlersintn]

Well see, I did not know that.

I think you guys are set up differently than we are. We have team states, followed by individual sectionals, districts, regionals, then states. Don't you have team states the day or two before your individual tournaments start?

 

[russelscout]

I think you guys are set up differently than we are. We have team states, followed by individual sectionals, districts, regionals, then states. Don't you have team states the day or two before your individual tournaments start?

Yeah, I was wrong on that. A couple guys already corrected me. I wasnt familiar with PAs format.

 

[russelscout]

I know. It would have tempered the pain from when we shock you in Minneapolis.

Hey, I am aware we can still lose. Ive had 10 years to keep my expectations in check.

 

[nitlion6]

Hey, I am aware we can still lose. Ive had 10 years to keep my expectations in check.

Keeping your expectations in check should be difficult. There have been an Iowa team or two that was close to PSU (2015, totally better but so was OSU), but this year Iowa should win. A PSU title this year would cause you guys deep emotional pain. I think you enjoy the ride and let those expectations run wild.

 

[Flying_Tiger]

This is exactly it, but it would take a bit. The reason Carver is loud is because it has been for a long long time. No new person is going to feel uncomfortable about taking part in the rowdiness when everyone else is exactly the same. BJC just doesnt get used enough to develop that kind of consistent atmosphere. Why hasnt it been moved to BJC full time yet?

Pennsylvania has had a proud tradition of wresting fans for the past century. It's not by chance that the state has had the most Division I wrestling programs and produces the best high school wrestlers. That's why it's so laughable whenever I see the comment about discovering wresting in 2011.

Meanwhile, Iowa fans culture is rooted in the Dan Gable dynasty, not wrestling itself. Many are more like pro football fans, emotional, big talkers desperate to attach themselves to a winner to feel good about themselves. When they do this, of course they are going to be loud and vocal at the duals, that guy on the mat is fighting for their manhood, whether they personally are a winner or a loser.

 

[El-Jefe]

This is exactly it, but it would take a bit. The reason Carver is loud is because it has been for a long long time. No new person is going to feel uncomfortable about taking part in the rowdiness when everyone else is exactly the same. BJC just doesnt get used enough to develop that kind of consistent atmosphere. Why hasnt it been moved to BJC full time yet?

Aside from Rec Hall being a fantastic home venue ...

Because PSU Wrestling has to rent the BJC. It's a consequence of the devil's bargain PSU made with the PA state government to get the facility built. B10 required an upgraded basketball arena for conference admission in the early 1990s. PSU wasn't about to pay the entire bill. So PA funded a basketball arena and concert venue. Everyone else has to pay.

Attendance needs to be around 12k to break even. Doable vs. Iowa or Ohio State or Lehigh. Harder for that Friday night Indiana match in Jan/Feb with a 3-hr icy drive on the Rt. 322 mountain. CHA has had some imperfect attendance in recent years, so surely that is relatable.

 

[nerfstate]

Russel—we’ll get you a ticket to Rec Hall (trust me, it will be there), for next year’s dual with the Hawks. Then you can be the judge on the venue and our fans. I think you will be surprised. As a fan of a rival team, you may leave with new appreciation for the BJC afterward.

 

[russelscout]

Aside from Rec Hall being a fantastic home venue ...

Because PSU Wrestling has to rent the BJC. It's a consequence of the devil's bargain PSU made with the PA state government to get the facility built. B10 required an upgraded basketball arena for conference admission in the early 1990s. PSU wasn't about to pay the entire bill. So PA funded a basketball arena and concert venue. Everyone else has to pay.

Attendance needs to be around 12k to break even. Doable vs. Iowa or Ohio State or Lehigh. Harder for that Friday night Indiana match in Jan/Feb with a 3-hr icy drive on the Rt. 322 mountain. CHA has had some imperfect attendance in recent years, so surely that is relatable.

Russel—we’ll get you a ticket to Rec Hall (trust me, it will be there), for next year’s dual with the Hawks. Then you can be the judge on the venue and our fans. I think you will be surprised. As a fan of a rival team, you may leave with new appreciation for the BJC afterward.

I actually love the excitement at Rec Hall. It looks fantastic on television. No doubt it is one of the top wrestling facilities in the country as far as atmosphere goes. I guess my belief about the facility comes not from a place of criticism, but from a place of excitement about another large fan base.

A little background on me, of course I am a Hawkeye fan. I was born and raised in Iowa; same home town as the Brands bros actually. However, I did not go to Iowa. I wrestled at a smaller level. I have been involved in youth, high school and college wrestling. I have had athletes and friends go to other D1 schools and have success there. I just like to talk wrestling in general unless someone jumps on me with a bunch of unwarranted Hawkeye hate.

I see the success that PSU is having and IMO right now there are only 2-3 teams that can consistently pack a large venue. Thats something to be excited about and wrestling as a whole should take advantage of when we can. Of course I was not aware of the fact that BJC needs to be rented out. That does create some new problems. Thanks for your guy's imput.

 

[El-Jefe]

I actually love the excitement at Rec Hall. It looks fantastic on television. No doubt it is one of the top wrestling facilities in the country as far as atmosphere goes. I guess my belief about the facility comes not from a place of criticism, but from a place of excitement about another large fan base.

A little background on me, of course I am a Hawkeye fan. I was born and raised in Iowa; same home town as the Brands bros actually. However, I did not go to Iowa. I wrestled at a smaller level. I have been involved in youth, high school and college wrestling. I have had athletes and friends go to other D1 schools and have success there. I just like to talk wrestling in general unless someone jumps on me with a bunch of unwarranted Hawkeye hate.

I see the success that PSU is having and IMO right now there are only 2-3 teams that can consistently pack a large venue. Thats something to be excited about and wrestling as a whole should take advantage of when we can. Of course I was not aware of the fact that BJC needs to be rented out. That does create some new problems. Thanks for your guy's imput.

I hear you. It would be great if more teams were selling out full arenas routinely.

OTOH, it's also great to have an annual spectacle that draws attention. So there is.a trade-off, at least for now.

BTW, Rec Hall capacity is 6502 (and I've been to matches where the fire marshal didn't count very carefully). For comparison, capacity at the brand new Columbus Tanning & Deadlift Mecca = 3700.

Point being that right now high demand is the priority across the sport.

 

[russelscout]

I hear you. It would be great if more teams were selling out full arenas routinely.

OTOH, it's also great to have an annual spectacle that draws attention. So there is.a trade-off, at least for now.

BTW, Rec Hall capacity is 6502 (and I've been to matches where the fire marshal didn't count very carefully). For comparison, capacity at the brand new Columbus Tanning & Deadlift Mecca = 3700.

Point being that right now high demand is the priority across the sport.

Thats true. That facility at Ohio St. was a good move for them. A couple years ago Iowa went to Ohio St. and it was a packed. It was an odd site to see so many people appear to not want to be there. The environment at their new facility is much better.

 

[HawkFan1986]

Guess your confidence went up again with the potential Nevills injury.

Any news on this front? I hope he’s okay. I hate seeing anyone go down, but this can be a brutal sport.

 

[dicemen99]

This excellent discussion on fan base/culture got me thinking about my visit to Ithaca this weekend.

First of all, Ithaca was great. For a little city in the middle of nowhere NY, it's got some nice spots, nice hotels and I'm sure is a pleasure to visit in the summer. I enjoyed it even as we were walking back to the hotel from the Irish Ale House at -1 on the thermometer.

But I see people whine all the time about Iowa fans - how insufferable they were when they were winning; now they are whining about PSU fans with many of the same complaints.

We should all thank our lucky stars that Cornell didn't win the NC championship in 2011. Iowa fans should be applauding the Long transfer, rather than decrying it. If they ever run off a couple of NC's people will find out what insufferable really means. Cornell wrestling is the epitome of arrogance and Dake is the poster boy.

This won't go over well with some here, and it really has nothing to do with the whole Dake-Taylor thing (to be honest, although DT is just a great, great wrestler, he's really not my cup of tea in terms of being a favorite). But Dake's antics in the corner are horrendous. Disrespectful. I give guys a break when they are competing - it's a combat sport and sh*&t happens. But when you're in the chair you should be held to a higher standard. Some guys just can't flip the d-bag switch off. And the rest of the staff isn't far behind. Best thing I can say about Koll is he doesn't really get involved. He just sits there and let's it happen.

Don't take this as an indictment of the kids on the mat. They were fine. Zack's opponent, Tucker, I have followed him for at least 6 years now, since he won the ETR OW, and you couldn't meet a nicer kid or a classier competitor. Fortunately, he hasn't been "Cornell-ified."

 

[nitlion6]

State College plus Iowa City = 29,000 for two wrestling matches on a single Saturday night.

Lehigh had 10,000 for the PSU match a couple years ago.

ASU set an attendance record for the PSU ASU match in December.

People will show up for perceived entertaining matches.

NCST has a program brewing. IMO it would be a good thing if PSU traveled to Raliegh for a November Friday night match and follow it up with a visit to Campbell on Sunday. It would be cool if the state of NC could have a couple matches that drew 8, 9 or 10 thou.

 

[nerfstate]

This excellent discussion on fan base/culture got me thinking about my visit to Ithaca this weekend.

First of all, Ithaca was great. For a little city in the middle of nowhere NY, it's got some nice spots, nice hotels and I'm sure is a pleasure to visit in the summer. I enjoyed it even as we were walking back to the hotel from the Irish Ale House at -1 on the thermometer.

But I see people whine all the time about Iowa fans - how insufferable they were when they were winning; now they are whining about PSU fans with many of the same complaints.

We should all thank our lucky stars that Cornell didn't win the NC championship in 2011. Iowa fans should be applauding the Long transfer, rather than decrying it. If they ever run off a couple of NC's people will find out what insufferable really means. Cornell wrestling is the epitome of arrogance and Dake is the poster boy.

This won't go over well with some here, and it really has nothing to do with the whole Dake-Taylor thing (to be honest, although DT is just a great, great wrestler, he's really not my cup of tea in terms of being a favorite). But Dake's antics in the corner are horrendous. Disrespectful. I give guys a break when they are competing - it's a combat sport and sh*&t happens. But when you're in the chair you should be held to a higher standard. Some guys just can't flip the d-bag switch off. And the rest of the staff isn't far behind. Best thing I can say about Koll is he doesn't really get involved. He just sits there and let's it happen.

Don't take this as an indictment of the kids on the mat. They were fine. Zack's opponent, Tucker, I have followed him for at least 6 years now, since he won the ETR OW, and you couldn't meet a nicer kid or a classier competitor. Fortunately, he hasn't been "Cornell-ified."

I haven't seen/heard much of Dake's cornering. What does he get up to that leaves you with such a foul taste?

 

[dicemen99]

I haven't seen/heard much of Dake's cornering. What does he get up to that leaves you with such a foul taste?

Well, the smirking and laughing in a small venue is pretty much in everyone's face. Something that I expect from the kids in the middle of a heated match, not from a coach at an Ivy league institution. One of the matches - 165, where Binghamton is using a deep sub because of several injuries - I think my SO was ready to run down from the stands and smack him in the face (she might, she's got anger issues, lol). Thank god it wasn't her kid on the mat.

 

[El-Jefe]

Well, the smirking and laughing in a small venue is pretty much in everyone's face. Something that I expect from the kids in the middle of a heated match, not from a coach at an Ivy league institution. One of the matches - 165, where Binghamton is using a deep sub because of several injuries - I think my SO was ready to run down from the stands and smack him in the face (she might, she's got anger issues, lol). Thank god it wasn't her kid on the mat.

Fess up -- you wouldn't have stopped her either.

 

[dicemen99]

Fess up -- you wouldn't have stopped her either.

Not a chance in hell.

I would have advised you not to either if you were in the vicinity.

 

[nitlion6]

Not a chance in hell.

I would have advised you not to either if you were in the vicinity.

Pissed Mama bears are scary creatures.

 

[El-Jefe]

Not a chance in hell.

I would have advised you not to either if you were in the vicinity.

I was asking more about the Dake angle ... but that works too.

 

[mvattivo]

Wow. I've been banned from HR. I honestly don't think I've done anything even close to ban-worthy. Any information from the HR group?

 

[mvattivo]

I got banned for posting this in response to their cheating accusations:

 

[mvattivo]

They deleted the post and banned me.

 

[El-Jefe]

I got banned for posting this in response to their cheating accusations:

Fake news.

Everybody knows @Tom McAndrew is the one with the itchy trigger finger.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

This excellent discussion on fan base/culture got me thinking about my visit to Ithaca this weekend.

First of all, Ithaca was great. For a little city in the middle of nowhere NY, it's got some nice spots, nice hotels and I'm sure is a pleasure to visit in the summer. I enjoyed it even as we were walking back to the hotel from the Irish Ale House at -1 on the thermometer.

But I see people whine all the time about Iowa fans - how insufferable they were when they were winning; now they are whining about PSU fans with many of the same complaints.

We should all thank our lucky stars that Cornell didn't win the NC championship in 2011. Iowa fans should be applauding the Long transfer, rather than decrying it. If they ever run off a couple of NC's people will find out what insufferable really means. Cornell wrestling is the epitome of arrogance and Dake is the poster boy.

This won't go over well with some here, and it really has nothing to do with the whole Dake-Taylor thing (to be honest, although DT is just a great, great wrestler, he's really not my cup of tea in terms of being a favorite). But Dake's antics in the corner are horrendous. Disrespectful. I give guys a break when they are competing - it's a combat sport and sh*&t happens. But when you're in the chair you should be held to a higher standard. Some guys just can't flip the d-bag switch off. And the rest of the staff isn't far behind. Best thing I can say about Koll is he doesn't really get involved. He just sits there and let's it happen.

Don't take this as an indictment of the kids on the mat. They were fine. Zack's opponent, Tucker, I have followed him for at least 6 years now, since he won the ETR OW, and you couldn't meet a nicer kid or a classier competitor. Fortunately, he hasn't been "Cornell-ified."

Hah re the Cornell staff. A certain spouse of a coach is a real piece of work on Twitter. Arrogant for no reason. Thank God Zain stuffed Yianni for many reasons, but one reason was to shut her incessant trap up for just a day or so on Twitter.

 

[Conewago]

Pennsylvania has had a proud tradition of wresting fans for the past century. It's not by chance that the state has had the most Division I wrestling programs and produces the best high school wrestlers. That's why it's so laughable whenever I see the comment about discovering wresting in 2011.

Meanwhile, Iowa fans culture is rooted in the Dan Gable dynasty, not wrestling itself. Many are more like pro football fans, emotional, big talkers desperate to attach themselves to a winner to feel good about themselves. When they do this, of course they are going to be loud and vocal at the duals, that guy on the mat is fighting for their manhood, whether they personally are a winner or a loser.

I doubt that this is true. While it's true that Iowa Hawkeye wrestling became what it us under Gable, first of all, Gable wasn't alone: I forget the guy's name (Iowans help me out here), but he actually was an assistant under another coach who won Iowa's first team title. That coach really started the path.

But it isn't like the Iowa Hawkeyes were a total nothing on the landscape either. They had won several individual national titles, like with the great Olympian Terry McCann.

Third and most importantly, the state of Iowa already had a tremendous wrestling tradition, which Gable simply tapped into to make the Hawkeyes so strong. In a certain sense, he did what Cael has done at Penn State.

Basically, if Gable hadn't built up the Hawkeye program, maybe all those people would be big Cyclone fans as they were when Gable wrestled at ISU. But their love of Iowa Hawkeye wrestling is definitely deeply rooted in a statewide appreciation for said sport. And we owe that state's culture a debt ourselves, because quite a few coaches in Pennsylvania had roots in Iowa. The most obvious one being Bill Koll. Up to mid 20th century, Iowa was to wrestling almost what Indiana was to basketball. (Actually, it's kinda sad that Iowa high school wrestling isn't what it once was. Ditto Oklahoma, which John Smith has said is way down from the old days.)